Hello all, Killswitch here with the next list of our series. 1750pts tends to be the norm nowadays in most Tournaments, so it’s a fairly solid value to go by.I personally write my lists as a standard template at this points level, rather than the previous 1500 which, a few years ago, was the absolute standard.
I like this point value, it balances most of the codex’s and allows almost every army to bring a fair amount of models to the table. So, for today’s list, I’ve decided to supply you all with one of my very own lists which I personally use.
Not saying this is original, nor am I saying I own writes to it, so go ahead and use it for your own games.
Now at such a point level, there are a few armies to fear. The main ones tend to be Guard, Daemons, Blood Angels (mainly with Mephiston), Eldar & the upcoming Grey Knights. To handle these, I have had to think hard about some kind of synergy which builds a fairly Hybrid approach.
Starting from top to bottom again, same advice stands with the HQ choice. Standard Rune Priest with Jaws & Living lightning. I tend to stay away from the powerhouse HQ’s at this point level for Space wolves as I feel that we need as much as possible to handle the army builds out there at the moment.
Elites is fairly abnormal. No Wolf Scouts & no Lone wolves. Instead I’ve gone for 2 Dreadnoughts with 2 Twin-Linked Auto cannons. These provide anti-mech & MC support. 8 twin-linked shots a turn, who can sit behind terrain or Rhino chassis fairly easily, without reducing their output, is pretty good. 250pts for these two bad boys is fairly standard. Next is wolf guard, but I will detail them bellow.
Troop choice is going to be slightly different. I will start with the assault element. 4 units of 5 Grey Hunters in Rhinos with Meltaguns & Banners. 500pts for these 4 gives me fairly good armour saturation and fulfils the Msu type of approach I am trying to aim for (multiple small units for those who don’t know what MSU is). Attached to these are wolf guard equipped with Combi-meltas & Powerfists. Now the reason for this fairly common load out in small units is that I do find it necessary to give these units a weapon which can give them a chance to at least hurt anything in the game. Many a time has my small 6 man units been bogged down against a fairly tough unit when they could of at least potentially hurt or even kill them with the inclusion of a fist i.e. a 5 man plague marine squad.
The defence element of our Troop choice is a 5 man Grey Hunter squad with a Meltagunin a las/plas Razorback. Well this unit can potentially sit back on home objectives and score, or act as our speed bump.
Next is our Fast attack. 2 single Thunderwolves with Wolf Claws. 70pts a pop is a steal, and provides us with some solid (and usually ignored) combat units. I tend to run these alongside each other, and people tend to ignore them due to the threats provided by the Rhino squads. I love the wolf claws capability to re roll to hit OR wound. When I need to take down a big creature, that re-roll to wound is great. When taking down basic troop squads, the re-roll to hit means I am almost guaranteed to put a rather big death toll on them.
This brings our total to 1317pts. Last but not least is our Heavy support. 2 Units of 6 Long Fangs with 5 Rockets and Las/Plas Razorbacks. Solid Fire support with transports providing further AP2. They also provide my Dreadnoughts with cover if used as backfield firesupport, and they can also help deploy my long fangs in decent postions in Dawn of war. Move the Razorbacks on up to 12 inches and the deploy the Long fangs 2 inches out of the doors, then run. This can put your long fangs straight into ruins to provide them cover, rather than relying on a difficult terrain roll followed by a run.
I chose only 2 Units of fangs to try and at least minimise my already large amount of Killpoints, and with the Split fire ability, I think its safe to say that its not a necessity.
The army should now look something like this:
Rune Priest: 100pts
Living Lightning & Jaws.
Dreadnought: 125pts
2 Twin-linked Autocannons.
Dreadnought: 125pts
2 Twin-linked Autocannons.
4 Wolf Guard: 172pts
Power Fists & Combi-meltas.
5 Grey Hunters:125pts
Rhino, Meltagun & Banner.
5 Grey Hunters:125pts
Rhino, Meltagun & Banner.
5 Grey Hunters:125pts
Rhino, Meltagun & Banner.
5 Grey Hunters:125pts
Rhino, Meltagun & Banner.
5 Grey Hunters:155pts
Razorback with Lascannon & Twin-linked Plasma Gun. Meltagun.
Thunderwolf: 70pts
Wolf Claw.
Thunderwolf: 70pts
Wolf Claw.
6 Long Fangs: 215pts
5 Rockets & Razorback with Lascannon & Twin-linked Plasma Gun.
6 Long Fangs: 215pts
5 Rockets & Razorback with Lascannon & Twin-linked Plasma Gun.
Grand Total: 1747pts
I think this a fairly balanced and effective competative wolf list. With 9 Hulls it makes full use of redundancy (plenty of multiple unit so if you lose one, you still have another to fall back on) and duality (Rhino squads can act as melta support or smash units in combat with the fist support, banner & decent number of basic attacks).
Whats lacking? no wolf scout, no reliable anti-deathstar (will have to rely on speed-bump tactics, blocking & consentrated firepower, which there is plenty of) and speed. I lack the usual Land speeders for decent blocking & quick melta support. I feel however that with soo many units on the table (MSU) you can pick and choose your targets and counter react to your opponents targets even with half your army on on side of the board and one on the other (although I do not recommend this type of deployment often).
What are peoples thoughts? Deployment for this army is fairly basic. rhinos provide one another cover and advance, preferably at all times keeping 2 together to support one another. Razorback take to midfield/home base duty and dreadnought act as the fire base support with the long fangs. Fairly simple and static. Thunderwolves react to threats if facing an assault army whilst against a gunline they use the advancing rhinos as cover.
Hopefully that explains the army in detail.
-Side Note-
Just so everyone knows, you can contact me on spacewolvesblog@hotmail.co.uk found on the sidebar. Feel free to message me at any time with army list critiques and I will try my best to get back to you. Please state as much info as you can and ask if you would like it featured on the blog or just a personal reply :)
Killswitch
15 comments:
March 11, 2011 at 3:24 PM
We are seeing more and more MSU Space Wolves list. One reason why I think this is the case is that Space Wolves are not the king of the ring when it comes to close combat. On the other side of the coin though we are not the top shot either, yet the MSU armies are trying be just that.
S feel that these types of list are only applying half of our strengths while ignoring the other half. So ask yourself what is the genetic code that makes Space Wolves stand out from the pack. One of the answers is our ability to bring not just one Power Based weapon to a Grey Hunter squad but 3. The first is the squad itself, the second thanks to an attached Wolf Guard and the third being a Wolfen's rending attacks. Counter Charge also indicates that we are more orientated to close combat.
In the end I feel that we should be using our troops (grey hunters) as the foundation of our assault element while using Long Fangs as the foundation for our Fire Support.
March 11, 2011 at 7:40 PM
I completely agree with that last paragraph. I find using thunderwolves as distraction and counter attack really works.
As an aside I have the core of my army decided on, but can decide between lasplas razorbacks for my 2 long fang units, for extra long range anti tank and increased ap2 firepower, or 2 mm/hf landspeeders for better anti tank against heavy tanks, I worried that against landraiders I'd lose a grey hunter squad to the landraiders occupants if they closed to meltagun short range.
What do you think wolves need more ?
Rathstar
March 11, 2011 at 9:20 PM
If ur playing back field with the gray hunter razor squad, i recommend dropping it and taking two units of inquisitorial storm troops with either 2 plas or melta (ur choice) for 70 pts then they hitch a ride in the long fangs ride. Then rifilemen are for codex marines, drop them for wolf scouts, giving u a threat in there back field allowing u better board control.
March 11, 2011 at 9:49 PM
Some people won't like you bringing el cheapo Storm Troopers.
C:SW is already perhaps the best Codex and some people resent that. Creaming the Quiz elements might be how to 'Lose friends and put out people'
lol.
Just sayin'.
+++
On the Rifleman, I think Anonymous's opinion [I apologise - I am not meaning to start flaming you, lol] is classic of the Wolf Communities attitude. It must be Wolfy.
Whilst that is great for fluff, I think you are actually robbing yourself of a] effective units and b] a new and challenging way to play - which is more exciting for you and your opponent.
Ultrawolves for the win ;)
Also, think of Wolves as Ultras+
Be shooty and movey. Then when they have made it through the firestorm *that* is when you use you Marine+ ability in mêlée.
Be patient in your hunting :)
March 11, 2011 at 10:17 PM
There's a great quote in Prospero Burns that describes the need for tactical choices like the rifleman dreadnoughts.
"The 6th Legion has a reputation." said Bear.
"All the Legions Astartes have reputations," replied Hawser.
"Not like ours," said Ogvai "We are known for our ferocity. We are thought to be feral and undisciplined. Even brother Legions consider us to be wild and bestial."
"And you're not?" asked Hawser.
"If we need to be," said Ogvai. "But if that was our natural state, we'd all be dead by now."
He leaned down towards Hawser like a parent addressing a child.
"It takes a vast amount of self control to be this dangerous" he said.
March 11, 2011 at 11:12 PM
I was the anon,
I wasnt trying be wolfy, i just believe the wolf scouts are better, as they let u control the game a bit better. though it comes down to preference. With out them the only way i could see u threatening the russes is with rushing up the rhinos. Also if my opponets are mad im building the best list i can, they i dont really care. mabye they should just be better. ;) its why comp tourney suck
March 11, 2011 at 11:29 PM
We have the best choices of options. They can all work if played correctly. Having a little of everything works best for me. BUT YOU MUST HAVE SOME SORT OF RIGHT HOOK to be continually competitive in 40K. Shooty wolves can win, but are boring and can loose that battle to many builds of armies. A balanced list with a lot of tricks in the bag will fair better for all comers.
March 11, 2011 at 11:30 PM
I just always happen to bring a right and left hook! :)
March 11, 2011 at 11:32 PM
Sorry for the double post and @marshel best codex! have u not read the guard codex? they just have to pay 2 times the cash for there army then normal. Between physic choirs vets and hydras? it makes me a saddddd space wolf. (there is no anger or aggressiveness intended by any and all posts from me) Though im off topic...
March 12, 2011 at 10:37 AM
It is about time you posted a 1750 point list, in OZ that has been the standard for ten or so years.
It looks a little 'cookie cutter' (which I don't mind) and would suffer a composition hit for that. Not liking the small pack size, too easy to knock over.
I know Thunderwolves are the flavor of the month but I would be taking a Land Speeder with MM/HF, they still work well.
March 12, 2011 at 10:46 AM
Thunderwolves are not the favour of the month in the uk. I still regularly get asked why I still run with them.
Luckily I have managed to shoe horn in a respectably sized and equiped TWC+ lord unit with 2 full squads of GH, 3 lf units and 2 speeders with flame and melta. Sure helps having all that juicy stuff. Its hard to take certain units to the butchers block to squeeze stuff in but as Adam pointed out in a previous post. Sometimes you just have to reconsider what is performing and what is not.
I like Alex's list. You can see that its pretty solid. Not to my taste but he gets results with this army/type of army. I have occasionally ran with the single TWC with claw and it is an awesome combo. waiting to pounce behind rhino's it can and should beat squads pretty easily as long as it does not die! The WG fists in that number is also nasty. I love fist and Banner combo's :D But I roll a lot of ones to wound!
Alex - is this what your taking to the GT? Also Adam, What are you going to be running with? It will be interesting to see who of the Space wolves blog will come out top dog!
March 12, 2011 at 3:04 PM
I like the list, it's smart and flexible. With that many meltaguns running across the table you should definately be able to torch a gunline army across the backboard like a lit cigarette. I also think having 9 hungover viking armor values staring you down can be intimidating(at least my wolves are always hungover)
I am torn however, and I'd like your insight with the Rune priest. I've had good results with both, stickin him with grey hunters up front, or leaving him back there with the long fangs guarding the beer. Up front he can fire off jaws, maybe Sparta kick some guys down a hole. His psychic null ability is very useful up front. But in back he just chills firing off L.Lightning and should anyone deep strike or otherwise threaten the long fangs, his force weapon offers a little cc clout. With the coming GK psyker prevalence i'm inclined to think that up front is a good place for the runic weapon, but I'm just sooo sick and tired of initiative 6 it gives me a headache. (my main friend/opponent is a nid player)
Kinda off topic; I really enjoy reading this blog. Keep up the excellent work all you guys.
-fat old wolf
March 13, 2011 at 5:57 PM
I've got to say I wouldn't leave home without wolfscouts, but equally they can be really hit and miss. For me the look on a Tau players face when you start bringing reserves on from his table edge is priceless. But some games they can be lack-luster at best.
March 14, 2011 at 11:33 AM
@ Happydude: Wolf scouts certainly are nice, but I decided on the rifleman simply because of the ammount of Low AV we see on the tabletop. For example, AV 12 spam guard, AV 11 spam marines & the like, MC's from nids & Daemons etc etc. Its nice to have a consistant souce of output. Wolf scouts are nice but you will not always face a gunline. If I do, and take it on the chin and handle them with my own long range fire power, and melta toting hunters heading their way. The army has a bucket ton of anti-mech targets, that a guard player wont know where to start!
@Anonymous: The Rune priest should ALWAYS be in a grey hunter squad. 110pts for a living lightning chodder in the backfield is pointless. Utalise those pts wisely. Jaws, psychic protection, LD 10, a Runic weapon & an extra ablative wound. Those are what they are there for so use them :)
@ Mike: I wont be using this list at the GT mike, but instead something fairly similar. Think slightly large yet less rhino squads, and lone wolves instead of dreads for a playtest :)
Alex
March 18, 2011 at 11:49 AM
Kinda off topic here (but on the topic of lists ;):
My friend plays dark eldar, and he envies me (SW player) this great blog as a source of lists and comparison.
I saw you (Killswitch) mention in a previous post that dark eldar have become more of a tourney staple recently. In relation to this I (and my friend) were wondering if you could give some examples of what kind of DE list people would bring to a 1500 or 1750 pts tourney? Doesn't have to be a complete list, but maybe an example or two of key units/army types (do they for instance do MSU?).
Only thing I've gathered so far is that trueborn blasterboats, ravagers and wracks with haemy are good choices.
Any input (from anyone really), or suggested blogs/pages, appreciated!
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